Today is the birthday of Hillary Rodham Clinton, born October 26, 1948.
Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton - Topnews image
Happy birthday, Hillary!
Without citation, Robert A. Nowlan’s Born This Day lists this as something Clinton said:
Being a Cubs fan prepares you for life — and Washington.
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(The Life of Reason, vol. 1: Reason in Common Sense)
Ed Darrell on Texas's Colorado River
Come on in, the water's fine. Come often: Cleanliness is next to godliness.
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Follow @FillmoreWhite, the account of the Millard Fillmore White House Library
Retired teacher of law, economics, history, AP government, psychology and science. Former speechwriter, press guy and legislative aide in U.S. Senate. Former Department of Education. Former airline real estate, telecom towers, Big 6 (that old!) consultant. Lab and field research in air pollution control. My blog, Millard Fillmore's Bathtub, is a continuing experiment to test how to use blogs to improve and speed up learning processes for students, perhaps by making some of the courses actually interesting. It is a blog for teachers, to see if we can use blogs. It is for people interested in social studies and social studies education, to see if we can learn to get it right. It's a blog for science fans, to promote good science and good science policy. It's a blog for people interested in good government and how to achieve it. BS in Mass Communication, University of Utah Graduate study in Rhetoric and Speech Communication, University of Arizona JD from the National Law Center, George Washington University
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[…] this is mostly an encore post. Fighting ignorance requires […]
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[…] this is mostly an encore post. Fighting ignorance requires […]
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Hi BF!
No, I’m not completely on the opposite page as you here. I think there’s some nuance to work through but for a large portion of what you’re saying…we agree.
I do note, for accuracy’s sake, that Somalia was not a Clintonian enterprise. George H.W. Bush sent the U.S. military there a couple weeks before the inauguration in what a cynic would suspect was a clear attempt to start the Clinton Presidency on a sour note.
But to that, I suspect you would say — “then why didn’t Clinton just pull the troops right out on day one”? And for that, I have no good answer. The guy was a conservadem…not my cup of tea…he got my vote, as Obama did, by being the least bad of all the bad choices.
As to what we did in 91, here’s the thing — Iraq invaded Kuwait and was making quite a show of preparing to invade Saudi Arabia. We had treaty obligations with Kuwait, but those aside…what would you have suggested as an alternate plan? I am not asking this for any reason but a desire to learn. I am stymied. Kuwaitis were being tortured and murdered. Saddam Hussein was planning to gain control of Saudi oil and possibly perpetrate additional human rights violations farther down the peninsula.
I really don’t like the neocon answer to all that. No, not one bit. I am not sure the Paultards have anything but “pie in the sky” answers either — if they have answers at all.
I don’t know. And I hate that I don’t know. Help!
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Ellie,
..and, oh, it was under Clinton that the economic sanctions he forced upon Iraq that killed 500,000 children.
Unless of course you, like Madeline, believe it was “worth it”.
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Ellie,
You suffer the dangerous disease called “Moral Equivalency” – that is, as long as you kill fewer then the murderer before you makes you not a murderer.
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Hi Jim!
Yugoslavia
Afghanistan
Sudan
Iraq
Somalia
To argue that the “results” of killing innocent women and children are a “good” is the extreme of human perversity.
“528 Yugoslav civilians were killed in the ninety separate incidents in Operation Allied Force”
He ordered the bombing and he and those that dropped the bombs killed these people.
Are you saying the bomb let loose all by itself from the bottom of a plane?
The best plan would have been NOT to even be there.
Why do you believe it is necessary to involve oneself in an affair not of our concern?
Would you equally claim
“I can’t blame the murderer for shooting back at the victims he was trying to kill, because – hey, the victims are shooting at him while he is trying to kill them! It must be the victims fault for the shooting!”
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Black Flag opines, “Clinton is as much a murderer as Hitler.”
Anything you might say after the above is so much dirty water down the drain. Too bad, because I actually enjoy reading this blog, but silly trolls are really not much fun. They just annoy because they know it teases. Ah well, I’m sure eventually you’ll move on and find another playpen.
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Hi there Flag!
What nation did Bill Clinton attack? If you’re referring to the Balkan intervention, you and I are probably pretty close to being on the same page. I blasted Clinton at the time for getting the United States embroiled in what I was certain would be a bloodbath. My thinking was that World War One began there, the Serbian-Russian link is a substantial one and I really wasn’t sure I wanted my country — with or without NATO and the UN — tweaking Russia, especially as she was feeling her way after the fall of Communism.
On paper and logically, I still think I was right. If, after a thousand years, Europe is incapable of policing Europe, then what are WE doing there?
In hindsight, though I haven’t changed my view, I cannot argue with th results. Not a single US serviceman or woman died as a result of enemy fire in the Balkans. Accidental deaths and suicides occurred, but were dramatically few — in comparision with Iraq.
As to dropping bombs on women and children, I think the last President to actually issue such an order was Nixon. The Decider’s war of choice in Iraq certainly was immoral, unjustified and brutal. But I don’t know of a single instance where he — or the military — intentionally bombed civilians who were known to be unarmed. That said, the death toll among Iraqi civilians is astronomical. What was the death toll among Serbian civilians as a result of US/NATO bombs?
Of course, you may also be referring to Clinton’s continuation of H.W. Bush “no fly zone” policies. Would you say the best plan would have been for us to simply get the hell out of Kuwait and Saudi Arabia? If so, I’m delighted to finally find something you and I agree on. While the 1991 Gulf War might have been necessary for the single purpose of liberating Kuwait from Iraqi occupation…the same question as with the Balkans remains. When are countries going to state behaving as regionally responsible actors? If Kuwait is invaded and subject to human rights abuses (beyond what the Royal Family was already inflicting on their people — ), then why could the Saudis, Turks, Syrians and a non-Western coalition liberate her? (We know why, of course — because they knew we would do it FOR them…though some of them deserve a modicum of credit for actually participating in ODS.)
But since the no fly zones were in place, and since Clinton lacked the political will or capital to end our attempt at Gulf hegemony, I cannot blame the military for shooting back.
The rocket attacks ordered by Clinton on Sudan and Afghanistan were based on mediocre intel — and were intended to take out Osama bin Laden. They were at least as justified as the original invasion of Afghanistan by The Decider in 2002. I tend to be isolationist and very much appreciate the Libertarian position — up until the United States is actually attacked. Then, I want the enemy prevented from ever doing so again.
Tragically, The Decider took his eye off the ball in Afghanistan and with a close election against a decorated war veteran coming, he opted for war number two — which was 1000% unjustified and totally counterproductive.
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James
Sadly, you do represent the majority of Americans.
Thoughtless, careless, and ignorant.
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James,
Clinton attacked a country who was no threat to the US.
He ordered bombs dropped on women and children.
His administration saw to economic sanctions against a country that was no threat to the US that cost the lives of 500,000 children.
Clinton is as much a murderer as Hitler.
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Sorry, Ed, last comment was to “James”
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Ed,
No, I mean opposed to Laura Bush and her criminal husband too.
Just because there is one murderer on the table to your left does not excuse the murderer on your right.
There is proof – no one is brave enough to present it.
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Black, you mean as opposed to Laura Bush who is married to a coke head, alcoholic, war criminal and the person who nearly single handedly bankrupted the country?
Yeah you have no proof that Bill clinton or his wife is a murder or a drug dealer.
You are a stupid idiot who foolishly believes everything that Faux News tells you because you simply are too much of a chickensh– to think for yourself.
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Ellie,
I am a bit more concerned about her participation in Satanic rituals in the Oval or the fact that she was known to dance a little jig every time she heard about a fetus being aborted.
But yes, there was her obvious burning hatred for American motherhood, the troops and her homicidal machinations. Didn’t Jerry Falwell prove as much?
And don’t forget those coded instructions she and her husband had imprinted on the backs of road signs — so occupying UN forces could find their way!
Ah, the 90’s were such a happy time for tinfoil hatters. I wonder if we shall ever experience their like again?
Say — have you seen Barry Sotero’s birth certificate lately?
::: runs :::
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LOL You left out, “Refused to meet with Gold Star Mothers!”
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Being a liar, a thief, married to a cheater and probably a drug dealer and probably a murderer and maybe one yourself – prepares you for a life in Washington.
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